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	<title>Comments on: Can a foreigner ever understand China (and other epistemological quandaries</title>
	<atom:link href="http://peijinchen.com/blog/2008/10/02/can-a-foreigner-ever-understand-china-and-other-epistemological-quandaries/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://peijinchen.com/blog/2008/10/02/can-a-foreigner-ever-understand-china-and-other-epistemological-quandaries/</link>
	<description>ponderings of a pococurante</description>
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		<title>By: Armen Shirvanian</title>
		<link>http://peijinchen.com/blog/2008/10/02/can-a-foreigner-ever-understand-china-and-other-epistemological-quandaries/comment-page-1/#comment-4151</link>
		<dc:creator>Armen Shirvanian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Oct 2008 19:04:33 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I would point out that a foreigner would have a difficult time understanding China if they have different environmental conditions in their homeland.  Understanding a place can only be accomplished by feeling what people in that place feel on a daily basis.  It is not possible to feel crowded, expendable, or pressured in a location where characteristics that cause those feelings are not present in relevant amounts.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would point out that a foreigner would have a difficult time understanding China if they have different environmental conditions in their homeland.  Understanding a place can only be accomplished by feeling what people in that place feel on a daily basis.  It is not possible to feel crowded, expendable, or pressured in a location where characteristics that cause those feelings are not present in relevant amounts.</p>
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		<title>By: Brendan</title>
		<link>http://peijinchen.com/blog/2008/10/02/can-a-foreigner-ever-understand-china-and-other-epistemological-quandaries/comment-page-1/#comment-4147</link>
		<dc:creator>Brendan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Oct 2008 06:38:39 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Most of the negative comments on that post were actually coming from a thread at Tianya started by someone who took offense at the live-blogging coverage of the Opening Ceremonies on my English blog, and then put up a post about how I was a two-faced hypocrite who laughed at the Chinese behind their backs. 

All of this stuff used to bother me, but I&#039;ve now taken it as the flip-side of the talking-dog effect that made my Chinese blog popular in the first place: one is either a lovable foreigner (It&#039;s so clever! It can speak Chinese!) or a mean-spirited China-basher, and there doesn&#039;t seem to be much of a middle ground for those of us who do more or less have a grip on what&#039;s going on, but don&#039;t necessarily fall all the way into either camp. It isn&#039;t a criticism that gets leveled at Chinese dissenters, though: I don&#039;t think anybody would claim that Qin Hui doesn&#039;t understand China, or that someone like Gao Zhisheng is a China-basher. They get accused of other things. 

I&#039;m not sure exactly what it means to understand a country, but it sounds like a pretty big claim to make. I&#039;ll be the first to admit that I don&#039;t &quot;understand China.&quot; Hell, I don&#039;t understand America either, and I&#039;m from there. I also don&#039;t understand Ireland, though going by some of the arguments I&#039;ve heard about, e.g., ABCs or Singaporean Chinese, my ancestry should predispose me to doing so. 

I absolutely agree about having lines - but here is where understanding really does come into play: I think democratic elections and rule of law are pretty cool things that every country ought to have, but even a superficial understanding of the realities of present-day China may make one sympathetic to explanations of why they aren&#039;t possible for China right now. On the other hand, it tends to make one much less sympathetic to arguments that China &lt;em&gt;shouldn&#039;t&lt;/em&gt; have them.

Sorry - very disorganized comment. I&#039;ve been meaning to do a brain-dump on the subject at some point, but I promise, I won&#039;t do it here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Most of the negative comments on that post were actually coming from a thread at Tianya started by someone who took offense at the live-blogging coverage of the Opening Ceremonies on my English blog, and then put up a post about how I was a two-faced hypocrite who laughed at the Chinese behind their backs. </p>
<p>All of this stuff used to bother me, but I&#8217;ve now taken it as the flip-side of the talking-dog effect that made my Chinese blog popular in the first place: one is either a lovable foreigner (It&#8217;s so clever! It can speak Chinese!) or a mean-spirited China-basher, and there doesn&#8217;t seem to be much of a middle ground for those of us who do more or less have a grip on what&#8217;s going on, but don&#8217;t necessarily fall all the way into either camp. It isn&#8217;t a criticism that gets leveled at Chinese dissenters, though: I don&#8217;t think anybody would claim that Qin Hui doesn&#8217;t understand China, or that someone like Gao Zhisheng is a China-basher. They get accused of other things. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m not sure exactly what it means to understand a country, but it sounds like a pretty big claim to make. I&#8217;ll be the first to admit that I don&#8217;t &#8220;understand China.&#8221; Hell, I don&#8217;t understand America either, and I&#8217;m from there. I also don&#8217;t understand Ireland, though going by some of the arguments I&#8217;ve heard about, e.g., ABCs or Singaporean Chinese, my ancestry should predispose me to doing so. </p>
<p>I absolutely agree about having lines &#8211; but here is where understanding really does come into play: I think democratic elections and rule of law are pretty cool things that every country ought to have, but even a superficial understanding of the realities of present-day China may make one sympathetic to explanations of why they aren&#8217;t possible for China right now. On the other hand, it tends to make one much less sympathetic to arguments that China <em>shouldn&#8217;t</em> have them.</p>
<p>Sorry &#8211; very disorganized comment. I&#8217;ve been meaning to do a brain-dump on the subject at some point, but I promise, I won&#8217;t do it here.</p>
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